Update, September 4th, 2019:
Just the other day, I received news that Rainmaker Digital Services / Nimble Worldwide (or whatever they’re called… I’m truly confused…) are finally ready to launch their “new and improved” (given their history, I find that somewhat hard to believe, let alone buy into…) version of the Rainmaker Platform: Rainmaker Platform Andromeda.
Now, it may be cool. I don’t know. And never will know. I never want to know. They burned their bridges (and hurt their brands) when they abruptly decided to spin off Rainmaker to some digital marketing services company – and make Rainmaker Platform part of a services push (read more about that below, if you’re curious) – thereby leaving me, and many other Rainmaker Platform users, with the heavy (!) burden of migrating our sites to WordPress, or alternative platforms and parts, like Teachable, Thinkific, ActiveCampaign, ConvertKit, Leadpages, etc.
Then, almost simultaneously with the Andromeda launch, Brian Clark yesterday announced in a blog post, that he’s returning to Copyblogger.
Whatta a surprise, eh?
Not really.
Despite the spin and stories along the way, Brian Clark only remained CEO of Rainmaker as a temporary PR deal, to ease the transition, and make it appear less like what it really was: Copyblogger wanting to get rid of a problematic product – without losing too much face, and to reduce panic among its Rainmaker Platform users.
And I suspect he was mostly there, pro forma. As a front figure. Not there, on a day to day basis. Just write a newsletter, every now and then, to show he’s there. That’s speculation, though. But isn’t it telling how Brian mentions Rainmaker Platform only ONCE in his “back with Copyblogger – here’s what I’ve been up to” blog post?
Update, May 15th, 2019:
Just a I predicted in 2017 (see my original post below – under the “Wild Speculation Alert” headline) Rainmaker Digital Services has now been 100% acquired by Nimble Worldwide.
Needless to say (my prediction considered): it doesn’t surprise me. That whole joint-partnership thing Copyblogger / StudioPress did back then, seemed to me like damage control.
Copyblogger wanted to get rid of Rainmaker. Likely because the support burden ate the profit margins, and development costs skyrocketed as they realized users expect more from a platform touted as the complete solution for infopreneurs wishing to sell online courses, market their services, do email marketing, podcast, and much more.
Selling the whole platform to some (IMO) random marketing services business, would mean admitting failure – and hurt their brand – by alienating and leaving behind, their loyal customers whose websites and businesses relied upon the Rainmaker Platform.
Since then, I’ve been contacted by quite a handful unfortunate business owners, who wanted to migrate from Rainmaker to WordPress, just like I myself did.
I saw it coming.
And with the StudioPress theme business having since been acquired by WP Engine, I honestly wonder what the hell happened to/with Copyblogger… ? They used to be a major player within the WordPress community and blogosphere – a huge force to be reckoned with.
What are they up to these days?
No matter their future plans, I personally don’t have much faith in their stuff any longer, as a burned Scribe customer, Premise customer, Rainmaker customer…
Brand trust is like a relationship. It doesn’t feel like Copyblogger can truly commit. So why trust any upcoming products they may launch?
That’s how I feel.
They even changed their name to Rainmaker a couple years ago… So who are they now? StudioPress? No, that’s WP Engine…
Hmm…
Update, April 17th, 2018:
What happened to the Rainmaker Platform? As I’ve already written previously, it’s no longer available to new customers, unless you want the full services package from Rainmaker Digital. So it’s time to look for alternatives. Who are the closest competitors to the Rainmaker Platform?
My personal choice and recommendations for a Rainmaker Platform alternative:
If you’re looking to create an online course, Teachable is a good choice. What makes them stand apart from Thinkific, is that they have an iOS app that lets your members conveniently enjoy your course content on their mobile devices. Thinkific doesn’t have such an app.
Furthermore, Teachable vs Thinkific handle your payments differently: Thinkific considers you to be the seller. Teachable acts as the seller. They’re the “marketplace”. As a result, Teachable will drastically simplify your accounting, as they simply send you a monthly payment, no matter how many customers you’ve sold your online courses to. If you’re in the EU, this means you don’t have to bother with the cumbersome EU VAT / One Stop VAT MOSS regulations.
IF those two differentiators aren’t important to you, Thinkific is as good a choice as Teachable.
And if you’re not looking for a full-on online course platform, but simply looking to sell digital files such as ebooks and such: Gumroad is my choice for that. Just note that they don’t allow selling services – so if you’re a coach looking to bill customers for Skype-sessions: you can’t use them for that.
Any questions? Feel free to ask in the comment-section at the bottom of the page.
Update on November 27th, 2017:
I’ve spent the last few weeks migrating my site from Rainmaker, back to WordPress.
When I signed up for their Rainmaker Way whitepaper (aka: sales letter) I noticed Rainmaker Digital’s email marketing was handled by GetDrip.com. I found that strange and a clear sign they don’t trust their own RainMail email marketing service.
I couldn’t justify investing more time in a platform with such an uncertain future. If any.
The process of rebuilding my site on WordPress has brought along several new, interesting insights that I’ll be sharing in upcoming posts. So be sure to stick around and keep an eye on the WebMatros blog!
PS: If you want help moving your site from Rainmaker to WordPress, I can help you with the migration. Just shoot me an email.
Update on October 30th, 2017:
The other day I realized what’s been troubling me about the new direction of Rainmaker. Brian Clark has referred to it as “Software and a Service” (as opposed to Software as a Service, i.e. a typical SaaS). However, that’s not the case. The new direction is rather “Service… and some software”. In other words, the Rainmaker Platform is secondary.
And now that the Rainmaker Digital site has finally been “soft-relaunched” – it confirms my above conclusion. Rainmaker as a platform is almost a footnote.
What does that mean for current Rainmaker Platform customers? Honestly I don’t see it as good sign. Despite my overall faith in StudioPress / Rainmaker Digital and the following words by Brian Clark, they are a business after all:
You’ll also benefit from the software improvements that come from moving upstream. As we do more expensive custom development work for clients, relevant enhancements will find their way into the general platform, at no additional cost to you.
The Rainmaker Platform Goes Off the Market this Friday
Time will show whether that will actually happen. Seen from a business perspective, it’ll make more sense to keep those enhancements as in-house “templates” – easily repeatable processes, that can be sold again and again, as services to clients who request those changes.
In case you’re a current Rainmaker Platform customer wishing to migrate to a self-hosted WordPress solution: I can help you out – and may be your best option across the interwebs. Migrating won’t be easy, but there’s a lot that can be done. If you need my help, just get in touch.
Original post:
The Rainmaker Platform has now been “off the market” for more than 3 months. Since I’ve previously written so much about the Rainmaker Platform and my use of it, I figured it’s time I share my thoughts on this situation.
If you’re not familiar with Rainmaker, it’s a membership website platform (like Thinkific and Teachable) and much more. It’s for content marketing too. And email marketing.
In case you’re unaware: the Rainmaker Platform is built on WordPress. It’s essentially a remixed WordPress, customized to fit the needs of digital solopreneurs, content marketers, small business owners, coaches, etc.
There’s a lot of trust involved in choosing a platform like Rainmaker. While it is based on WordPress, major parts of it, f.e. the membership billing, LMS (learning management system), and landing pages, are proprietary.
So going somewhere else isn’t as straightforward as moving a standard WordPress site from one host to another.
Trust, is the key word here.
Currently, the Rainmaker Platform is still “off the market” and Rainmaker Digital (f.k.a. Copyblogger) are (still) in the process of merging the Rainmaker assets with another company, Nimble, wholly unknown to me and most other Rainmaker customers.
Hence this very post.
On May 17th, 2017, an email from Brian Clark trickled into my inbox. Subject-line: Big Changes Coming to Rainmaker.
After reading through it, I had what can best be described as mixed feelings. From one viewpoint, this is exactly what I’ve been waiting for. From another, this is a huge seismic shift of the platform on which my own website, and those of many other customers, reside.
Below, I’ll cite some important highlights from it, and share my own comments, inline:
Handing over the QWERTY-mic to Brian Clark:
We have an exciting development to let you know about – but I know sometimes change can be a little unsettling.
True.
When we rebranded the company from Copyblogger Media to Rainmaker Digital in September of 2015, it was a firm statement that put the platform at the forefront. But it was also a foreshadowing of where we saw things going.
If the Rainmaker Platform is at the forefront of the company – why separate it from from the rest of your operation?
(more on that below)
Our original goal was to create DIY marketing technology for entrepreneurs and small businesses that are doing content marketing themselves, either in-house or via freelancers. In the meantime, we’ve been turning away businesses happily willing to pay for a more complete solution.
And those businesses “happily willing to pay for a more complete solution” are… larger businesses? Rainmaker will now cater to corporate/enteRprise customers? It’s Not clear to me whether that’s the case. Such a change of focus will be reflected in the future focus of the product – hence a solopreneur/blogger like me want to know whether that’s the case. I’m sure many other, current Rainmaker customers can relate?
There are many ways to develop a client services department, but given that we’ve been product-focused for over a decade, we weren’t arrogant enough to think we could just pull it off effortlessly.
Wise choice.
In the last year, we’ve explored several viable ways to do more for our customers and prospects as a hybrid technology and digital marketing service provider. After careful deliberation, we’ve come up with a path that allows us to expertly provide anything that a Rainmaker user needs.
Reading between the lines, yet pure speculation on my part, here’s what I think might have happened:
The Rainmaker team were surprised by the burden of development and support involved in a product like Rainmaker.
What’s easy for a techy type to do… isn’t easy for Jane and Joe. Yet, Jane and Joe wanna do all that fancy stuff “everyone else” are doing.
Feature-requests kept coming in. Support-requests (with pleas for customizion-help) kept coming in, too.
Development and support “speed up the metabolism” of a business: human resources are depleted, rapidly.
Morphing the “burden” of development and support into paid services makes sense: it’s a way to fund new features and make sure support (as in: helping customers with customization) is economically viable.
Rainmaker Digital has entered into a letter of intent to partner with an existing digital agency, Nimble Worldwide. We’ve had a long relationship with Nimble, as they were our email marketing provider for years before we developed our own internal solution, RainMail.
I thought FeedBlitz was their email marketing provider? Anyway, good to know it’s a trusted, long-time partner.
More on Nimble later in this post.
Effectively, the Rainmaker assets of the company (excluding StudioPress, Synthesis, Copyblogger, Authority, and DCI) will be combined with Nimble in a new entity, with us as the majority owner.
This is one of the most unsettling paragraphs, which Brian later repeated in his “Last Chance to Get the Rainmaker Platform at the Current Pricing” post on Copyblogger.
Why separate the Rainmaker-assets from the rest of their activities?
That “majority owner” part worries me. Yes, Rainmaker Digital is the majority owner… But for how long?
Wild Speculation Alert!
Wearing my tinfoil-hat and playing devil’s advocate (ha! Sounds like Chuck – Saul Goodman’s brother) this could be a way to sell the Rainmaker assets, without losing face while easing the transition by maintaining joint ownership for a while.
Copyblogger could then, when the time’s right, sell their majority ownership and BOOM: Rainmaker Platform is no longer a “Brian Clark & co” venture. Heck, I’m not even sure there’d have to even be a “boom” – not a publically traded company, disclosure-requirements are limited, so should they reduce their ownership: it could likely happen – without a sound.
I’ve experienced such a situation before: a great hosting business turned into a monkey-zoo (really) after it was sold to Cheech & Chong (apparently). From one day to the next, writing their support was like contacting Beavis & Butthead or Lloyd and Harry (Dumb and Dumber).
First of all, that means you can rest assured that the company that you’re doing business with today remains the company you’re doing business with going forward. And of course, I remain as the captain of the ship.
That’s one of the most reassuring statements in the email. I want Brian Clark to remain captain of the ship.
It comforts my “inner Chuck McGill” – I’ve almost switched the lights back on and taken off my tinfoil-hat. Almost.
(off-topic: if you haven’t watched Better Call Saul – you better:)
That said, this deal will add an experienced team of digital marketing pros to ensure that our go-forward solutions are expertly crafted and professionally delivered. I’m 100% certain that this is the smarter move for our customers and prospects compared with trying to build an internal agency from scratch.
I concur. But why take the stand-alone platform away? Why not let current and future customers decide whether they want (or need) services or not?
Why not just refer customers with customization needs to Nimble – or to a new “Rainmaker Services” agency?
That way the services business would have to prove its viability first. And if it failed, the Rainmaker Platform could remain active. Leaner, more agile.
What Can We Help You With?
The first meaningful impact of this will be that we can do anything you need related to your digital marketing efforts. That includes:
– Design
– Development
– Strategy
– Content Creation
– Adaptive Funnel Sequences
– Turn-Key Digital Marketing DepartmentOn that last point, we’ll be able to provide clearly-defined bundled packages that allow you to quit thinking about marketing, and to focus on the rest of your business. If the ROI is there, why would you say no?
I’m very curious to see how you’ll manage to provide clearly-defined bundled packages for diffuse, individual customer needs. And such needs change, for each customer, from one month to the next. Either the customer ends up paying too much, or too little.
And pricing it competitively – in a world with freelancers and outsourcing services everywhere: that’s a whole topic in itself.
Granted: if the work delivered is good (it has to be) it’s worth paying for. More on that later in this post.
We’ll be rolling out access to both project-based and retainer-based solutions in the coming months. You’ll be the first to know.
Still waiting. Eagerly. We’re now in October. The email was sent in May. Patience is a virtue, and I feel I’ve been very virtuous.
One Big Change Going Forward
All of this restructuring is aimed at offering you more options from a trusted source. Of course, with any major escalation in value, there are changes to the way things have been.
The biggest change is that going forward, we will no longer sell the Rainmaker Platform to new customers a la carte. In other words, the sales process will become more like an agency, and less like a “pull out your credit card and sign up online” SaaS.
Honestly, that sounds so alien to me. More like Infusionsoft / Microsoft / HubSpot – on steroids. A big sales team. Consultants. Suits. White collars. Handshakes. Deals.
Doesn’t sound like something from Copyblogger – or the world of WordPress for that matter.
Feels like a change of market focus. Huge one.
Next, you’ll benefit from the software improvements that come from moving upstream. As we do more custom development work for clients, those enhancements will find their way into the general platform, at no additional cost to you.
I (and other Rainmaker-customers I’ve talked to) just wish the “stuck in beta” page builder would be ready for prime time. It’s vital, in a world where WordPress-using competitors have shiny sites built easily with Beaver Builder, Divi, Elementor, and other WordPress page builders.
Finally, the move to full service means you never have to experience frustration at what you can’t do with Rainmaker. If you have a specialized need, we can make it happen for you for a reasonable fee.
Sounds nice. I’m all for the whole “offering services” idea. I just don’t see why they need to be mandatory, a new business entity formed, and so on.
I’m looking forward to see the rates/pricing too.
In short, (and at the risk of overstating my case), you’ve made a good decision to build your digital presence with Rainmaker. Because it’s only going to get better for you as an early adopter, at no additional charge.
I hope so:)
Soon we’ll announce our plans to the general public, and begin the process of taking the current iteration of Rainmaker off the market for new customers. I wanted to make sure you understood in advance what that means for you.
Again: why take it off the market for months?
Why take it off the market – at all?
To facilitate a (re)launch?
Or wasn’t it profitable (enough) as a stand-alone solution?
We’re left in the wilderness, wondering, you know?
Thanks again for being a Rainmaker customer, and for reading all the way down. We’re fully committed to your continued success.
I’m glad about that last part:)
Needless to say, the email left me with an uneasy feeling and got me thinking. I didn’t sleep as well the following night.
Questions unanswered:
- Why not keep the Rainmaker Platform available at its regular price, with an optional services-upsell for customers who need or want it?
- Why merge with another company, before validating the concept?
- Who’s the new target-market? Solopreneurs and 2-3 person small businesses – or larger companies?
A month after the email, the Rainmaker Platform was taken off the market.
Now…
I like, and have a lot of faith in Brian Clark (Founder and CEO of Rainmaker Digital – f.k.a. Copyblogger). Brian is a true content marketing pioneer and thought-leader.
Not to forget the rest of the Rainmaker Digital team. Great people with heart aplenty in what they do.
Furthermore…
I agree with the idea of a serviced content marketing platform
A year or two ago, I had some similar thoughts myself, thinking “someone should create a digital marketing agency for small businesses. One a la Zirtual, but with vetted content marketing professionals”. So I’m quite keen on the overall idea of Rainmaker as a serviced content marketing platform – or “software and service” as Brian Clark has put it.
However…
Who are they partnering up with?
Nimble. Nimble Worldwide is the name of the digital marketing company that Rainmaker Digital is merging with.
Upon receiving the email, I first thought they were partnering up with Nimble, the social CRM service.
Could have been cool. But not the case.
So…
Who are they?
Visiting their website didn’t help much, despite it being online since at least 2010, according to Internet Archive’s Wayback Machine.
My first impression of the website, is one of underwhelm. This is not a website review, so I won’t start picking it apart here. Suffice it to say: when I showed it to my partner, she (who’s a design teacher, with a master’s degree in digital design) immediately pointed out even more flaws than I’d found.
As a website it’s fair enough. It’s just soooo far from the Rafal Tomal designs we’re used to seeing in Copyblogger/Rainmaker projects.
And Nimble are offering design services, after all.
Visiting their Twitter profile reveals a giant, pixelated cover image, and a profile image with a carelessly cropped logo:
(click image for a full-size version)
Not the lack of competence I’d expect from a Copyblogger/Rainmaker/StudioPress-venture.
Seeing their Twitter-profile, my partner began wondering whether they’re outsourcing their design-work to less skilled, cheaper workers abroad? I can understand that impression.
Anyway.
Their Twitter account has 75 followers, despite joining in January 2012.
I found their Facebook page too. It has 61 likes.
Their Pinterest account has 16 followers.
All above counts even include me:)
Few social media followers doesn’t necessarily mean a company is incompetent at what it does. They may simply be busy helping their clients succeed. As a freelance web designer, I put more effort into making client websites great, than into my own site. It worked well: I got plenty work just from the referrals of my happy customers. Maybe that’s the case with Nimble as well.
Still: a digital marketing agency named Nimble Worldwide with such a meager online presence is kinda strange, you agree?
Another, slightly amusing point:
When I researched their website with the Internet Archive’s Wayback Machine, it got clear why they’re named Nimble. Variants of the following quote:
“We are a marketing agency that does not do cookie-cutter solutions. We are nimble in our thinking & ready to use any tool to do the best job to drive business.”
The amusing part? That they’re now partnering up with Rainmaker Platform – one all-in-one tool. What if Teachable or Thinkific is better for the client?
I’m not making fun of – or pointing fingers at – their nimbleness, however. Not at all. I’m a huge believer in choosing the right tool for the client and job. Always.
It’s just… slightly amusing… or strange… for a company so deeply tool-agnostic that their name is built around it, to enter a partnership to work primarily with one platform: the Rainmaker Platform – “the Complete Solution for Content Marketers and Internet Entrepreneurs” – quoting the original Copyblogger launch post from 2014.
The Rainmaker Platform is good – but idiosyncratic. And at times a jack-of-all-trades. Nimble may feel less nimble, sticking with just the Rainmaker Platform.
Here’s hoping that will propel development forward at a faster pace than has been the case for the last year or so. Since RainMail was released, updates have been regular, but far from overwhelming in scope and utility.
Judge the tree by its fruits
What’s the quality of their creative design and development work done for clients? How good is it? If they’re to work on my website, and I’m to pay for it, I wanna know how competent they are – what I and other Rainmaker-customers can expect.
So I took a look at the latest client project posted to their Facebook fan page:
(click image for a full-size version)
Sorry to say, but typographically, that’s a disaster. Excessively long line-lengths, inadequate line-spacing, sloppy headline margin/padding, illegible link colors, poor alignment, font-size mayhem, and more… All design-school 101 basic stuff.
It’s not design-work at the quality-level of Rafal Tomal or Brian Gardner (Copyblogger / StudioPress chief designers) that’s for sure. Far from it. And I’m not being picky here.
Do I feel confident in Nimble’s abilities? I have to be honest here: I can’t say I do. But time’ll show.
So far we’ve been waiting since late May for concrete info, pricing, packages, wording. Still waiting. Quite eagerly now, 4 months later. The silence isn’t comforting. My once Rainmaker-hot heart goes cold, protecting itself from the risk of abandonment.
Honestly, this whole “we’re taking Rainmaker off the market, but thank you for calling, Sir. Please hold…”
(lounge music playing, and no indication of how long you’ll be on hold… is unsettling.
We don’t even whether we’ll be helped when someone finally answers.
As an analogy, imagine your partner suddenly told you he/she’s going abroad, somewhere, and coming back… at some point… soon.
But you don’t know when.
And will he/she be the same? Or better? Or worse?
At some point, you start losing faith. Bit by bit. And enthusiasm for the relationship.
And a website platform is a relationship. It’s a serious relationship, for any online business.
Copyblogger-products left in the dust
While Rainmaker Digital (the company – f.k.a. Copyblogger) have kept products like Genesis/StudioPress alive and well-maintained for the long-term, they’ve also axed a few.
Premise, a WordPress plugin for selling digital files, protecting membership content, and creating opt-in pages, was discontinued – and rolled into Rainmaker.
Scribe, the SEO / content optimization WordPress plugin was discontinued – and rolled into Rainmaker.
What does that tell us?
It tells us a couple of things:
Like any other business, Rainmaker Digital are ready to kill products. That can (of course) be a negative experience for customers who’ve bought and enjoy an axed product. I was a customer of both Premise and Scribe. In case of Scribe it was less of a bummer, because it was subscription-based, and wasn’t a vital part of my website. Premise on the other hand, was a lifetime, one payment purchase, and it was a product used to run part of your website. For such a foundational part to get discontinued, didn’t feel fair to me and other Premise-customers. At the time it wasn’t clear why* Copyblogger (now Rainmaker Digital) decided to pull it from the market. Later on, it’s become evident why: Premise was to be part of the special sauce that made the Rainmaker Platform the delicious dish it is.
From a positive perspective, it seems like their best ideas are absorbed into higher-level products, and often the Rainmaker Platform. That’s good news for Rainmaker Platform customers. It’s a signal they’re serious about it. That’s also what Brian Clark have stated, throughout the last three years: Rainmaker is where they’re putting their efforts.
Yet, lately I and other platform-customers have been wondering whether that’s still the case? Some feel the themes available on the Rainmaker Platform aren’t integrated as well with the platform as they could be. Others feel development of new features like a page builder have stalled, for whatever reasons.
There is some truth in those sentiments. Since spring this year, the monthly updates have been less and less extravagant. Bug-fixes, optimizations and such. It’s not that I’m ungrateful. I always prefer bug-free, stable, fast software, rather than lots of features added, at the expense of bug-freedom, stability, and speed. I’m sure you know what I mean though?
Life-support isn’t thriving. It’s stable, but not evolving.
In conclusion
I know some of the above might seem/sound/feel a bit harsh. It’s all written with passion and love. My many past Rainmaker-related posts make it clear I want to see it evolve and prosper, for the benefit of solopreneurs, small business owners, entrepreneurs, startups and alike. It’s a great product, unique in its comprehensive feature-set.
I sincerely hope my worries will be put to shame. Soon.
What do you think?
PS: In case you’re a current Rainmaker Platform customer wishing to migrate to a self-hosted WordPress solution: I can help you out – and may be your best option across the interwebs. Migrating won’t be easy, but there’s a lot that can be done. If you need my help, just get in touch.
Andrea says
Thank you, thank you, thank you. I’ve been a LOYAL Rainmaker customer for almost three years and I have two sites hosted by RM. I had a feeling over a year ago they were receiving acquisition offers. But I was assured by many RM employees that Brian would never sell. He admitted on a podcast he had received several offers and he wasn’t interested. Now I’m really f*****. And pissed. I don’t have the time, energy, or money to move two websites to WordPress (though I know how to manage WP content). Are the new owners going to keep the platform? What a mess!
Oliver Nielsen says
Hi Andrea
Indeed a very frustrating experience, and Brian Clark really lost a LOT of the trust he had otherwise earned himself, through his work on Copyblogger. A few years ago, when Rainmaker was spun off to Nimble, the communication from them oozed “corporate spin-doctoring” – political damage control. So inauthentic and dishonest, IMO.
Sadly that vibe has now fully proven its validity.
Thank you for commenting! I feel your pain, regarding the move of two WordPress websites. It ain’t something one does in a day or two, that’s for sure (I’ve done it).
Oliver
David says
Thanks for this post. It has helped to confirm my move to migrate from RM to WordPress. I’m using a combination of Thrive Themes, ConvertKit and Teachable to offer a membership site. Also got SamCart in there for the checkout. We’re about to go live on 1 Sept after several months of work. PS–Good work on your homepage. But one glaring omission is: “get a clear sense of direction about what??” – only as I scrolled down do I see that it’s about websites. Brand new visitor here – just thought first impressions are worth conveying.
Nik says
And now Studiopress has been sold to WPEngine. Thank the stars I bailed on RM early.
rachidii says
Hi,
Rainmaker always felt following an agreement me, and the designate support to at StudioPress has declined ever back imo.
Thank you.
Philip says
Thanks for updating, Oliver. I’ve been patiently waiting on RM to see what happens. So far, none of the promised “as we develop new features for our big clients, we’ll roll them out downstream to everyone, so it’s a win-win” updates have happened, and it’s been almost a year. It’s been ok because I’ve basically just been publishing content, and have been happy enough with RM for that.
Now I’m about to start building my first course, and I really don’t want to do all that in RM if I’m going to be migrating soon. So I’m looking at options. Teachable looks good for the reasons you mentioned, but I do want it to be integrated into my site, so that may not work for me after all.
I do wish that Brian Clark and RM would be more upfront about the roadmap and what their true desires are for a client base, rather than the middle of the road approach that hopes to keep us hanging on for promised improvements. I guess one could argue that if you look at how they’ve said things, that they couldn’t be more clear they don’t want us to stick around.
Oliver Nielsen says
Hey Philip
Thanks for commenting.
With CSS you can customize the look of Teachable to that of your site, to a certain degree (depending on your site’s design). Could that be an option?
Oliver
Philip says
Hi Oliver, I suppose that could be an option I could consider. I like simple and clean designs anyway. I liked the idea of my courses living within the Nav of my main site, but on reflection, it’s not really that important. I doubt people need to get back to our homepage while taking a course anyway. I guess what I would miss is the ability to login on our main domain, but a “Login” button that navigated to the courses wouldn’t be a bad compromise.
Oliver Nielsen says
Hey Philip
Indeed. And what you’ll gain is a faster and less (potentially) problematic site, as you’ll need half the amount of plugins you’d otherwise need. Once we say “online course” we also say “payment gateway” and all that other, related ecommerce stuff. With all that off-site, there’s much less to maintain;)
Oliver
Dainis says
Philip, really – you’ll be better of using 3rd party online course platform than your own WordPress path (with rare exceptions).
I learned that lesson the hard way by going fancy and custom.
Really Teachable & Thinkific are the best solutions. They are very similar on high level.
When you say integration in your site – what do you mean by it?
Usually you’ll have course/pro section standalone and while it appears as one piece, actually it is a separate piece.
—
If it’s branding you care about – better is Thinkific, because it offers 100% white-labeling – so nobody will know that you use anything 3rd party.
Which Teachable, there are still signs even on their pro plans.
—
I wouldn’t even look at Rainmaker nowadays – there is too much on table for Copyblogger and clearly their focus isn’t Rainmaker.
So just going with companies 100% dedicated to online courses, being around for 6 years( 2012 for Thinkific, 2013 for Teachable) and steadily growing – seems like no-brainer to me.
Anyhoo, would be happy to support and give some informed advice on which platform to go for. Each case really is unique.
But on high level – just any of these Thinkific – Teachable will do great.
Let me know!
Robert says
Hi,
Rainmaker always felt following an agreement me, and the designate support to at StudioPress has declined ever back imo.
Thank you.
Robert says
I am very concerned. As a digital agency, we are trying to move people away from Rainmaker. This is not just because I don’t want to feed my clients to my web host.
Rainmaker has always been very difficult to work with an even harder to love as a user/operator.
Good luck to them. Probably not for me or my clients.
Oliver Nielsen says
Hey Robert
Thanks for sharing your experiences and take on Rainmaker.
I’ve found it a fairly easy platform to work with, although with its own idiosyncrasies. Taking it “off the market” like this is disconcerting and I couldn’t figure out why: why they’ve done so, and why it rubs me in such a wrong way.
A few days ago, I finally realized what that is. I’ll update the post within the coming days, sharing that insight.
Have a great weekend Robert!
=)
Oliver
Phil says
Better Call Saul is one of the greatest shows ever. And I’m also anxiously awaiting these answers. Thanks for a comprehensive and balanced post.
Oliver Nielsen says
Hey Phil
Thanks for voicing in. I’m pleased you feel it’s a balanced post – has certainly been my aim. Was a bit worried it could be read as “sensationalistic” or such.
Indeed: Better Call Saul was a great series. At times it could be a bit slow-moving, but the actors, dialogue, characters, art direction, story – all makes up for it.
Kim Wexler added so much dimension to Jimmy’s / Saul’s character.
=)
Oliver
Erik D. Slater says
Good job, Oliver.
Here’s a more recent interview from August 2017:
https://foundr.com/brian-clark-rainmaker/
@ 22:20:
“The Rainmaker Platform … has now evolved into an agency concept that’s going to be relaunching in September”
In short … they’re late!!
PS. I run the Rainmaker Platform Community group on Facebook. Happy to provide the link, although I’ll wait for your approval first 🙂
Oliver Nielsen says
Hey Erik
Yep – they’re running late. On July 31st, Brian expected September 1st to be the launch date.
https://twitter.com/brianclark/status/892061940201046016
I’m not gonna blame them for the delay though. I know how things always take longer than expected, even when projecting ETA’s based on “worst-case scenarios” 🙂
Still: would be nice if they’d keep us current customers more in the loop on it.
Thanks for the link to the Foundr.com interview. I’d missed that one!
By the way: is your website still on Rainmaker? Or did you switch (back) to WordPress?
Absolutely, post the link for the Facebook-group, here. You’re welcome:)
Oliver
Erik D. Slater says
Here’s the link to the Facebook group (thanks):
https://www.facebook.com/groups/RainmakerPlatformCommunity/
An update would be nice.
The lack of news about the relaunch … the recent StudioPress Sites push on Copyblogger … the perceived history of how certain products have been handled in the past (Premise, Scribe, etc) … people in certain circles are getting twitchy about the Rainmaker platform disappearing. I don’t think that’s going to happen anytime soon though.
I have always had a live Rainmaker-hosted site, which is required in order to be a reseller of the platform. My main site used be hosted with Liquid Web, but I moved to Pressidium earlier this year.
I still use the Genesis Framework. Can’t see that changing anytime soon 🙂
Oliver Nielsen says
Hey Erik
Ah, today there’s finally an email update on “the future of the Rainmaker Platform” in my inbox:)
Of interest:
They “plan to open up to select new client relationships by early November.”
Sounds like they’re quite far from relaunching Rainmaker to the public. Will it be in 2017? Certainly not a certainty.
That said: I’m glad they’re communicating:)
What do you think?
PS: thanks for the Rainmaker Platform Facebook link. Have joined:)
Oliver
Erik D. Slater says
Happy to have you in the group 🙂
Given that the service was officially closed to the public, I think there may have been a need to communicate more frequently with their consumers … if only to allay any fear that the Rainmaker platform sky isn’t actually falling.
On the other hand, there has been a big push towards StudioPress Sites since January/February this year. They caught a few Rainmaker deserters that way.
Staying silent may have had the cleansing effect of giving some of the ship-jumpers the push they were looking for, or perhaps needed.
In 2017 alone, I have lost count of the number of clients and leads who tell me they signed up to the Rainmaker platform when it first launched in 2014/15, but then didn’t do anything with it. To be fair, this is more commonplace with many products and services than people realize … ClickFunnels being one of them.
This is one such group who are/were most likely to leave anyway.
With the platform relaunch, one objective – I would expect – would be to replace them with fewer new sign-ups who will spend more than the early-days pricing of USD 750/900 per year.
All speculation on my part, of course. I reserve my right to be wrong 🙂
Oliver Nielsen says
Hey Erik
Yes, people signing up for services like Rainmaker, Moz Pro, Kajabi, etc – but not using it, because “tomorrow never comes” is typical. But it’s GREAT cashflow for those companies. Such inactive users create very few support tickets. They’re passive income – literally. So I can’t imagine Rainmaker being interested in getting such customers off the platform.
For the active users, it could be true.
My own little conspiracy theory is that the RM-team have been surprised by the amount of support and handholding required. What’s easy for the RM-team, and people like you and me (with skills above average): it’s easy to wrap our heads around it and make it do “as advertised”. But to Jane and Joe: it’s hard.
So Jane and Joe sends one support ticket after another.
The solution? Start charging for all that handholding – or close shop. Brian and co chose the services route.
It’s also the way Infusionsoft and HubSpot operate (at a healthy profit). Makes sense for Rainmaker to do the same.
Still, I just can’t see why they need to take it “off-the-market” for so long. And doing it in the middle of the summer holiday season screams “we don’t want too many people to notive this” me finks 😀
It does feel shabby.
PS: I don’t think StudioPress Sites is targeting Rainmaker customers at all. Different segments. They’re just pushing it because it’s their freshest product: there are lots of conversions to be had;)
=)
Oliver
Erik D. Slater says
Oh absolutely. People who buy stuff … then they never use it … but they keep paying/renewing anyway? Those are keepers 🙂
This is the bit that interests me greatly … because it seems too many people don’t respect the amount of time and energy that goes into providing this level of support.
My hope is that the Services move will educate the Rainmaker Digital consumer who believes they have an entitlement to free support. Time will tell how the move pans out … but I do live in hope on this one 🙂
We can only speculate 🙂
While the platform was officially closed to the public, it has still been possible to get people in through the back door (so to speak).
I gave people access to a staging site through my Reseller account … just for a few days. If they were happy with things, then we would go through Support to get them onto their own Rainmaker account.
Oh yes. Definitely different segments, for sure.
StudioPress Sites is basically the new version of Web Synthesis … https://wptavern.com/rainmaker-digital-to-partner-with-nimble-worldwide => “Our Synthesis managed WordPress hosting line will be folded into the StudioPress brand at some point”
Perhaps not by deliberate design … but they did catch some people who planned to leave the platform at renewal time. For those, StudioPress Sites was the right move for them.
Jelle Annaars says
Hi Erik I’d be very interested to join as well (RM customer since pilot). But link doesn’t seem to work?
Oliver Nielsen says
Hey Jelle
The group has been closed, because the Rainmaker Platform is more or less dead.
=)
Oliver
Jelle says
Thanks Oliver. What made you draw the conclusion?
Oliver Nielsen says
Hey Jelle
It’s in my latest two updates at the top of the post. Plus the fact that more and more people decided to throw in the towel and migrate off the platform. The Facebook group was closed for those reasons as well.
Are you currently on the platform, or considering becoming a client there?
=)
Oliver
Jelle says
Interesting. I’ve been a RM customer since the beginning – the pilot. Was one of those people that end up hardly using the platform 🙂 until a month or so ago I decided I was finally going to set up a serious online courses business. So my focus is on the LMS/Membership features (still all free as of now).
So I’m a suddenly a heavy RM user. I have to say it more or less does what I want right now, except RainMail (disaster) and no integration with Drip or even Zapier. That being said, I’m disappointed with the way they handle support (migrating to another domain was an unnecessarily stressful operation). I don’t feel feature requests are taken seriously at all.
So I’m going to linger around and see where the platform goes. Who know My subscription is until June I think. I’ll be in touch with Rainmaker Services to see what they can do, and at what price.
Oliver Nielsen says
Hey Jelle
Regarding feature requests, I’ve had the same feeling. I think it’s because many of the platform’s features rely on third-party plugins, so they’re waiting for new features to be introduced in those sourced plugins. They may not do much additional development themselves, on each of those parts. So the forms are what they are, etc. And it’s why they’ve had trouble getting their Visual Page Builder (in labs/beta-testing) working properly with opt-in forms, RainMail, widgets, etc.
In essence: anything that goes beyond the original plugins abilities, has been hard for them to do. And it’s often difficult to build upon the code of other developers.
What has been your biggest gripes with RainMail? The autoresponders?
PS: if you ask their support nicely, they may do a pro-rated refund of your remaining annual payment. Up to their good heart though. Once you start getting customers/users in your online courses, migration gets vastly more complex, since the LMS is a proprietary part of the platform.
=)
Oliver
Jelle says
Hi Oliver, sorry for late reply — my kids were ill. I haven’t even activated RainMail, because my audience speaks Dutch and there were way too many standard snippets in English. That, btw, I wouldn’t want to use even if my audience was English-speaking. Next to that, the fact that it is list-based like AWeber, Mailchimp. I use Drip and couldn’t live without tag-based e-mailmarketing.
I’m going to stick with RM for now. It does most of what I need it to do right now. Isn’t it still a better alternative to stitching together the individual WP elements? Or would a tool like Teachable completely replace RM?
Oliver Nielsen says
Hey Jelle
No worries. Kids first, business second;)
Good point re: using RainMail for a non-English audience. I can also relate to wanting to change some of the default wording (and branding/styling for that matter). We wanna “speak” a consistent language to our customers and prospects. When default wording in f.e. subscribe and unsubscribe emails is used, it feels “off” to the recipient. It feels incongruent. A slight disconnect to the relationship one is trying to build.
After my switch back to WordPress (from Rainmaker) I investigated several options, and ended up with two finalists: ConvertKit and Mailchimp. Surprisingly, I chose Mailchimp. The key is using it (properly) with Groups. I may write a post (or do a video) on it in the nearby future.
Still, for different users and use-cases, Mailchimp’s autoresponders either make sense – or they don’t:) They make a lotta sense to me, for the same reasons they might make little sense to someone else:)
(has to be said I consider myself a Mailchimp pro/expert after I’ve done consulting and teaching to businesses needing a helping hand with it – so I may be biased)
Drip is good stuff, though!
Teachable can’t replace Rainmaker. The UX isn’t part of your website, so it lacks the deep integration you can do, in Rainmaker. If only there were more certainty in the platform’s future, I would have stayed aboard:)
So please be sure to report back in the coming months how you’re feeling about the Rainmaker Platform’s future direction.
I hope the kids are well now. Else: my best wishes for them <3
=)
Oliver
Scot MacDonald says
Rainmaker always felt like a reach to me, and the service at StudioPress has declined ever since imo.
Oliver Nielsen says
Hi Scott
Thanks for chiming in.
A reach? How? Can you elaborate a bit?
You feel StudioPress service declined since Rainmaker was launched? Due to reduced resources (dedicated to Rainmaker) or something else?
=)
Oliver
Jason Hobbs says
It’s indeed interesting Oliver.
I was their first Rainmaker Platform customer 5-24-2014 and using it since. I’m still an active Rainmaker Platform reseller as well.
I’m guessing Nimble brings some sales and project management talent to couple with the marketing strategy/media creation acumen of Brian and team. Then you add to that the long-term relationships with the StudioPress community of Genesis designers and Genesis developers. Then you add in the Copyblogger community of content marketers and writers and you’ve got gobs of talent available to work with the new Nimble/RM entity serving customers.
I believe the new entity is indeed going upstream to larger retainers and projects. It makes sense to me what with Brian and team’s proven marketing chops wrapped in a done-for-you bundle will appeal to bigger fish.
My most updated marketing strategy involves my I settling in under where I believe the new entity is going, ie up stream.
That means I’m focused on helping non-digital native Rainmakers of really small organizations, ala 1-10 employees.
I want to grow as many of those minnows into whales over a long-term relationship with me, rather than solely whaling.
Oliver Nielsen says
Hey Jason
Good to see you here.
I’m glad you’re mentioning the larger eco-system of Genesis freelance designers and Copyblogger freelance writers. My post is 3.300+ words, so couldn’t fit it all in and honestly forgot about that aspect. Brian have mentioned in one of his posts that they’ll open up opportunities for the community at some point in the future.
A vetted list of good freelancers would be nice. Wading through gazillions of “maybe” candidates on sites like Upwork and Fiverr can be daunting.
I like that you’re wanting to grow small businesses and solopreneurs. I’m passionate about the same “segment” – there’s so much potential out there: people with so much heart and passion for what they do.
=)
Oliver